Ep22 Building Strength and Becoming Antifragile by Overcoming Trauma

Gary De Rodriguez [00:00:00]:

Then we take the fragility we have felt from the trauma we've experienced, and we turned it into an antifragile powerful force of strength, commitment, dedication, and purpose. And when we do that, we find finally our center, and we finally find our purpose and our power.

Jason Croft [00:00:24]:

You any successful relationship starts with finding your center, the truth at the core of who you are. Only then can you develop the ability to truly connect with someone else. Concentric is about aligning with people who share a common center. This show gives you the tools and the skills to do just that through practical training, real life stories and examples, and in depth interviews with people who have taken this journey and come out the other side better for it. Welcome to Concentric. We're glad you're here. Welcome to episode 22 of Concentric. I'm excited to bring this episode to you. We really dig in in this episode around this idea of trauma, which is something we've touched on in the past, this idea that not necessarily big, giant trauma, although that also applies to what we're talking about here today, but even the small things that we need to overcome in life. But unlike past conversations, where Gary really focused on getting past it and digging into the subconscious and that process a bit on what that takes and the importance of getting through that, he's taking it a step further here. In this episode by showing us that it's not just a matter of getting past it, it can really be using it as a strength. Not only making the best of this trauma that happened in terms of put a spin on it. Or okay, well, thank goodness I went through that, because now I know this or that. Or thank goodness I was able to get past it. Right. Like, all of that and that's that base level, like, yes, get to that point. But sometimes going through this process, we can realize that we can use that trauma to be stronger than we would have otherwise or to know our life purpose when we wouldn't otherwise it disturbed us so much. Or the skills that we had to develop to get past that trauma or through it, even at a younger age, because we had to develop those skills just to kind of cope. Well, now they've become sort of a superpower. It's almost like they unlocked those powers within us and we may not have otherwise known. And it's a little bit of reframing, for sure. And yes, let's do that. But also really stepping into, okay, I went through this, and now I'm going to change the world because of it, or I'm going to have the greatest relationship with my kids because of this, because I went through this, developed this power to get through it, and now I've pushed past and resolved that trauma. Now I can have conversations and relationships, know, do things out in the world that I wouldn't have otherwise, and I think that's so powerful. So you're going to love this episode so much. Let's jump in. Gary, how the heck are you?

Gary De Rodriguez [00:03:45]:

I am really good, my friend. How are you?

Jason Croft [00:03:47]:

I am doing well. I'm excited to jump in and record some more of these with you.

Gary De Rodriguez [00:03:53]:

Well, I've been biting at the bit. I think it's time. We've both been super busy and now it's time to do something different.

Jason Croft [00:04:03]:

Yeah, absolutely. These are so much fun. And we've gotten some good feedback, fortunately, from the episodes, and I know just from doing the conversations that we have that this stuff is needed. It's so needed out in the world.

Gary De Rodriguez [00:04:18]:

It really is. I continue to sit back in my own private coaching practice and the consulting work I do as well. People are under so much stress and the fuses seem to be getting shorter and shorter and shorter. I know there was a mass shooting in New Mexico and the governor of New Mexico, which I'm going to respond to her, actually, the governor of New Mexico sent out a plea for people working with mental health to please contact their office because they are overwhelmed with the amount of violence. It was someone on the freeway with an AR 15 just shooting cars as they went by and killed a whole lot of people. And she's just like, we don't know what to do about this. We need mental health in the worst way. So I'm going to contact them, see if I can't bring in some of this trauma work. Because at the end of the day, people snap because they can no longer handle the emotional burdens they're carrying and they transfer that rage out into the world on anything and anyone. And until we can provide people with any level of skill or tools to actually manage themselves, then what begins to happen is with no tools, poor living conditions, access to weapons of mass destruction and mental health that's gone awry unless we help at the root cause, there's going to be no way that this is ever going to stop. And at some point, people will not be safe to even go to the movies or go to restaurants or go to concerts because you can't gather in large groups of people almost anywhere now without that constant fear. So this is not just a light subject that we're talking because you remember before we started the recording, you said, what do you want to address today? And I thought, I really want to speak a little bit more about trauma, but also about because trauma just generally makes us fragile. Right, but antifragility and trauma because also trauma can build a certain level of muscle in you that you don't get without adversity. So we have to look at both sides. Just like everything in life, there's a dark and a light. There's a yin and the yang. There's always something to be harvested from every difficult situation and this is for sure no different than that. So we want to be able to acknowledge that kind of strength that trauma can build. But there are certain things we have to do in the middle of it during this whole process of recovering from childhood trauma, especially is we want to be able to have a certain set of habits that we begin to form, to turn those aspects of us that have been fragile into something that's antifragile, that becomes our greatest strength.

Jason Croft [00:07:36]:

Yeah, and I love this idea, too, because it goes beyond just getting past something that's maybe been holding you back, which is a phenomenal first step, right? Phenomenal beginning to get through some of these traumas that we experience, both large and small. As we've talked about before, sometimes it can be this tiny, little, seemingly tiny event with no ill will to it. And yet your six year old little mind takes it and it becomes this thing that carries on through life. It's all of those things that we're talking about here. But what we're digging into today and I'm excited about is not just getting through that or getting over that, but actually excelling because it happened to you and almost like a martial art, right? Taking the energy of that and redirecting it and shifting it and using it back out in the world in a positive way with all that string. So I'm excited to dig in on some of the hows that we can use to do this.

Gary De Rodriguez [00:08:46]:

Absolutely. So we might as well just start. I shared with you before we started that a very good close, long term friend had committed suicide yesterday. And I did a lot of crying yesterday as a consequence. And I kept thinking, if I only would have known, if I would have known he was in that kind of pain, if I would have known that he was doing ketamine and these drugs that anesthetize and numb you out. But I didn't know. I sat back and looked at his life and he is such an amazing guy and such an amazing healer, but yet he couldn't apply to self. It's almost like incrementally the compounding traumas. And it was mainly well, it was all around his relationships, his relationships with girlfriends and with wives and with his children. And every single context of a close intimate relationship with him that was DNA oriented or family oriented was painful for him and overwhelmingly painful for him. And I thought he had it all handled and he was good and it wasn't, it wasn't good. And so as a consequence, we look at our lives and oftentimes if we don't have coping skills that can deal with our past, first of all, and we don't have coping skills to develop new habits of how we deal with the now, we will become overwhelmed. One of the things that I think even epigenetically that we look at because epigenetics is really the study of how our environments and our emotions and our behaviors actually cause an effect on our DNA. And what we have to look at is that our emotions cause a certain methylation in our DNA that causes certain genes to turn on or turn off. And this happens over time, and especially when we have childhood trauma, which actually even affects the size of our brains and the sections of the brain that actually fire off. Deep childhood trauma can shrink the size of the brain. So when we start looking at, like and this is another thing, we start looking at the violence that's on the streets right now, it's like, how do we know that these people did not experience deep, profound childhood trauma? And just physiologically, their brains have shrunk to a point to where they can't necessarily think through logically to the next level of what they need to do or habits they need to form. So some of the most important steps to take is education on what trauma does to us and then methodologies for how we start helping that level of fragility expand into a more full functioning human being. I've talked about the trauma memory solution technique before, and I keep coming back to that. There's other techniques that kind of bolt onto that as well, because trauma can be very pervasive and goes into not only the traumatic event itself, but all the compounding events that mirror that and then the beliefs that develop from those core significant experiences. So there are a variety of different aspects that need to be bolted onto the trauma memory solution technique to make a complete intervention for the individual. And then next to that, after that, there has to be habits that are developed. And some of the habits I wanted to talk about that is antifragile is really looking at what are the things we have to do because we all have trauma. People will say, I don't have trauma. No, you've got trauma. They've actually proven that when we're infants, the expression on our mother's faces when we were pre verbal can cause PTSD in a baby's mind. So go figure that. It's like, when I read that, I was like, holy moly. So we all have some form of trauma, either minor, major, acute compounded, we all have it. So the thing that we have to begin to start looking at is this deep exploration and curiosity to answer this one question. How did I become me? Like, how did I become this guy who sees the world like he sees it, experiences the world, interprets the world like we do, and is it based upon the best thing we've been able to make up so far about life? That's what it's really based upon. But that's not necessarily reality. That's just the best thing we've been able to make up so far. If we don't have a growth mindset and question how many different ways can I look at this situation that would return me to peace, that would return me to my core? I was on a podcast as a guest the other day, and the podcast host asked me, what are the three most important things to create a dynamic life? And I thought, could you be any broader? And I said spirituality, business and relationships. And he said, well, why that? And I said, Because we have to recognize that there's a light we carry. We're more than our bodies. We're greater than our thoughts. We're here to do something that no one else can do because they're not us. We have a certain range of relationships that we will participate in, certain lives. I think we're all meant to touch, hopefully be a great support for, grow from, learn from as well, but evolve. So we have to have a growth mindset. Part of that growth mindset is establishing your spiritual path. It may be a religion. It may be sitting in the woods alone in prayer or contemplation or admiration and gratitude. It could be watching a sunset. It could be any number of things. Whatever it is, your self defined. Personally, I think our relationship with whatever we're calling the Creator is quite personal and very private. So when we start looking at developing that, that becomes a sheet anchor for the tumultuous times that life brings us. Then when we look at business, if we don't sustain ourselves, because business success is always a reflection of our self esteem, how we feel about ourselves, who we are, how we view ourselves, what we feel our contribution has to be. Our work ethic is part of our strength and our mindset, as well as our self respect. So business is about really an external demonstration of who we are. Whenever I go into organizations and the CEO or the executive team will go, we don't know what to do with the culture. How do we improve the culture? I said, improve yourselves. The culture is an extension of your thought forms. They're an extension of your values. They are an extension of how you behave and treat others. If you do it, they'll follow. If you're inconsistent or incongruent in the culture you say you want. Or do you just want a great culture for profitability? Or do you want a great culture because you want your team members to be happy? Do you want to pad your pockets and say you have a great culture? Or do you want to actually be authentically living as an example of those qualities and those values? And that within itself will create a great culture because people will model you. So business is about an extension, a manifestation of our thoughts in here and the expression of our hearts. And of course, we have to have command over our particular industry, right? I'm not suggesting we just show up and it's all rainbows and unicorns. We hold hands and sing Kumbaya no, but this is the subtle part of business. Then the next is our relationships, which is, if those are broken, we carry that as a constant burden with us. I don't know about you, Jason, but for know, whenever I've had a broken relationship that I can't resolve, it eats at me like a termite on a piece of know. I have to have my relationships in resolution, and when they're not, it's extraordinarily mind consuming. So our relationships play a huge part in our overall happiness. And there are systems for all of that. I created creating incredible relationships primarily because of that, that people can go online and they can listen to those skills and those tools and those methodologies for improving the relationship dynamic with other people and with themselves. I'm going to be putting up some more classes as well. By the end of the year, those will be up. But the bottom line for all of us is that these three areas who I am with, what I feel is the purpose of my life. My creator, the ability to manifest my relationship with myself in business, to do good to multiple people, either my end users from my service or my industry, but especially the people that are helping me push the product or service out into the public, then my relationships, both external in my business and internal within my family system. When those are smooth, loving, communicated, healed and resolved, we are able to have a greater sense of power and a greater sense of purpose. When we don't have those resolved, it eats away at the energy that we need, our life force that we need to actually do what our life came here to do.

Jason Croft [00:20:24]:

I hope you're enjoying this episode. If you want to take a deep dive into the concepts Gary is talking about here and so much more, I've got something for you. From time to time on this show, you may hear us talk about Gary's course Creating Incredible Relationships. This course is the culmination of Gary's 35 years worth of seminars, oneonone training and transforming the lives of over 11,000 people on four different continents to learn how to build alignment, and heck, just get along with others sometimes. We all require skills that are not commonly known and are not out there in the relationship development space. We need help. That's why Gary put this course together. The content in it is powerful and comprehensive, but just like we've done with this show, it's put together in a way that's easily consumable and quickly implemented. To gain the ability to take every relationship you have or want to have to the next level, go to Gary'scourse Dot and see how to get started. Now back to the show. I love that you broke it down that way, too, because as you dug into, we kind of started with getting into how did I become who I am today? And really pulling back the layers and stuff. When I first hear that, I can imagine people's response with, oh my gosh, where do I begin with that? You know what I mean? You're 30, 40 years old and okay, where do I start with this? Right? And now I've got to just crumble everything down to the studs, right, like to the core and start over. And you've already given us some tangible ways to now take even those three areas. And you can break down all your different areas and break down your relationships even from there, but it helps to have those action, okay, here's how to analyze these things. It isn't just, well, now you need to go sit on a mountaintop and think about your life and how you did it and why and why you're here like that for four years and figure this out. But you can get quiet for a little bit every day. You can go through what are my values? Go through like, oh, what's feeling off right now? And I like that you've started to give us those tools because in getting back to our core topic of this, of not only getting past trauma, but now feeling the strength, this leads us into some of that. How when you can break down your life into these areas and you start to shore them up and strengthen in each area, I think that's really helpful.

Gary De Rodriguez [00:23:16]:

Well, it is. I wanted to just present what the big question is. When we know that we can operate our own ways, that we perceive that we can literally improve the interpretation of what's happened to us into a strength rather than into something that makes us fragile. We have choice now that literally the generations before us did not have. And so this is the point of I think for me anyways, where I'm devoting the rest of my life to is getting this information out in a solid learnable format so people will then have a choice that they can take this information and improve literally every area of their life. I know you know this because we're going to be speaking at the Achieve Conference in Denver. But the thing I got really clear on is I thought that this year especially, I'm going to start all the certifications. I haven't done certifications in years and I made up my mind that this is one of the highest things I can do with my life right now, is to teach people how to work with other people around this context of trauma and self actualization. And this isn't like the light, fluffy RA, let's go out there and do this. Oh, I'm going to hold you accountable. It won't be great. And I'll ask you some clever questions and you'll wake up. That isn't how this works. This is a much deeper dive. If we're going to create sustainable change inside of ourselves, we have to understand how the nervous system works, how the biology of emotions work, and we have to have very succinct systems that have been proven in the trenches with real clients over and over and over again. So I've developed a system over 30 years, more like 35 years and 30,000 clients. I have had this system that I've trialed out and said, okay, that works. That didn't work. That got good response, that got moderate response, that didn't get a response. When I see clients shift and change, I go, okay, let's write down what I just did, keep it in a file, go back, hone it down, create a process out of that, and let's trial it again. And then I trial it again. It worked again. I'll trial it again, it worked again. And then I'll know that's solid. That's solid. So what I'm doing now is taking how I have developed these processes in literally the laboratory of 30,000 clients over a 35 year career, and I've broken it down into a system on how to help people help themselves. Number one, then how to help people help others. Number two, as far as I'm concerned, you can't help anybody until you've helped yourself. You can't travel down a road or lead anybody down a road you haven't traveled yourself. So this becomes a task. It's sort of a passion project for me. This is what I'm going to do till I take my last breath. I'm going to train people how to work with other people so that we can begin to start minimizing the trauma out there and begin to start maximizing our purposes. And one of the things that I realized was that there are certain things because I had a very traumatic childhood, and what I understood about what happened to me because I survived it, and I did turn into a massive drug addict. I did go agoraphobic where I couldn't leave my house for a year. This is when I was quite young, like, 1718, and I was just fresh out of high school, and I was a dumpster fire. And what I realized was some of the key components that had to happen. I had to have a mindset for growth. I had to have a spiritual connection of some sort, which luckily I found. I began to start looking at, like, what is my purpose? What is this driver in me that I need to awaken inside of me? And that really happened when the AIDS crisis hit, when the age AIDS crisis hit. Sometimes what begins to define your purpose is what you find intolerable. And what I found intolerable was the inhumanity to man intolerable. What was occurring at the very beginning was they were talking about concentration camps. Anyone infected with AIDS, if a mosquito bit them, they transferred the AIDS to someone else. So it's like, let's lock everybody up and quarantine them. But that never happened, thank god. But what did occur was a lack of funding for any research. For years, there was no funding from the Reagan administration. Zero. And so, of course, it just spread and spread and spread, and millions of people died a horrible death, like perfectly healthy. Three months later, a skeleton and dead. So I began this process of saying to myself, first of all, we need education. So we know an educational format for people trying to find out what it know. Legislators from Sacramento immunologists from all the major hospitals, and we did open forums. The next thing I kept thinking was then how do we help and support that community who will be dead in three months? How do you do that? So we started the Course in Miracles, which is the Mystical teachings of Christ. We started the Rebirthing Program, which helped people release emotions. That wasn't enough, so I started studying. If people are going to make change really fast, they're going to make change at the subconscious level, not the conscious level. We don't have time for talk therapy. In that case, what we need to do is we need to find out how to shift them at the deepest possible level in the quickest possible manner. So I spent the rest of ten years in that community studying neuro linguistic programming, hypnosis, anything to work with the subconscious mind. I traveled all over training with indigenous elders trying to figure out what were their particular methodologies for creating change because they knew how to work with the subconscious. And out of that came this work. So what we need to do is, first of all, have this growth mindset. Be very curious. Look for the skills that are going to give you the deepest change, the fastest. That's going to literally affect the way you think, the way your emotional states are, so that your DNA epigenetically begins to shift on the right genes in your DNA strands so that you have more possibility. We have a redundancy of 1010 to the 11th power of neurological connections. Remember when I said your brain actually shrinks from childhood trauma? Well, it can also begin to expand again and create new neural connections. It is reversible. But we have to begin to start creating the right emotional environment inside of ourselves to do that, which means we have to change our thinking. We also require to I know this is going to sound a little odd, very obvious. We have to get really good sleep because that is the time that we restore our bodies. If we have been dragging around these unhealed issues from our past, then we have to allow our body to rest and get good sleep. We have to input into ourselves powerful inspirational information. So read great books, listen to inspirational podcasts, don't watch the news. Begin to limit the amount of fear that you let be programmed into you and build up your sense of purpose. And that will begin to start strengthening the core. Now, if you have a growth mindset, you're already on to, okay, I'm going to do that training and that training and that training because I need to align my values. I need to release the obvious big traumas in my past. I need to change my limiting beliefs into something empowerful. I have to look at transforming my language because language creates our reality. So what are the skills that I need to add on to me to actually actualize this part of myself so I can have more mental emotional management? And then on top of that, we have to actually create a network of supportive friends. We can't do this alone. No one does this alone. We have to have a group of supportive and I'm going to underline highlight, put in neon supportive friends. Not toxic friends, not people who are super negative that drag you into their drama. Not that supportive friends that are on the same general path you're on of desiring to wake themselves up to a higher, more actuated aspect of themselves. Then we have to find in the creator triangle which is opposite from the drama triangle, the crater triangle is I'm the creator of my reality. That's just a known fact. Like I give the meaning to everything I'm experiencing outside myself. So whatever meaning I give, it's going to be the heaven or hell that I create for myself. But the other two aspects of the creator triangle is we have a challenger and we have like a coach. So we require to find someone that's going to help us ask us the right question, facilitate our breakthroughs, help us grow exponentially in a way that begins to start breaking through the crust of the things that have happened to us. So we can start seeing it differently. If we don't do that, we're going to be stuck. Like you can't fix something with the instrument that broke it. And our thinking is what has broken it. Our experiences have definitely contributed to it. But our thinking and the habitual attempting to resolve it with our minds, not our emotional self, we can't make those kind of breakthroughs on our own. So it becomes vitally important. We surround ourselves with really good people. And I think lastly we have to become a warrior. What I mean by that is sometimes trauma and things that are extraordinarily uncomfortable build a muscle in us that nothing else builds. Makes us passionate about something that normally you would not be necessarily passionate about. Like I am super passionate about helping people in the suffering between their ears because I know it's not necessary and it's reversible. I know that because I've done it inside myself and it's not perfect. But I'll tell you, it's light years from what it used to be and this becomes absolutely imperative. And when you become a warrior which presupposes, you become a leader. The foundation of leadership is self awareness. I was working with an executive yesterday. Yesterday I was working with him. Incredible guy. I. Just love this guy and brand new to anything. He had never done one thing. Not 1oz of therapy, not 1oz of coaching. And he said to me when the company contracted me to work with him, he said, I've been praying for something like this. I really want this. And I was really surprised. I'm like, awesome. And so we dove in, and he said to me yesterday, he said, Gary, you know that process you gave me last week? Because he does everything I tell him to do. I said, Practice this process two or three times a day. He goes, oh, my God. It was so incredible. I did it for a whole week, and it's like everything changed. I walked into meetings. I was totally emotionally different. People came up to me and said, what's happened to you? You're like, just like, in flow. And he goes, yeah, because I'm no longer afraid of rejection or not being enough or saying something stupid. I'm just sharing my knowledge as best I can. In that moment, he says, I finally feel free of the fear. And then I gave him another process to do, and he was like, I'm going to use this in everything my personal life, my business life. He goes, this stuff really works. And I'm like, yeah, it does. And then he said, I had absolutely no idea. He said, Our first session, you told me leadership was about self awareness. He said, I've been literally walking around to sleep. I have been completely unaware that these deeper issues and he's at a very high level in a major corporation. And he said, I've been unaware that the impact of these small childhood things that seem small to me as an adult were massive to me as a child, and they run me like an Aquifer under the ground of all of my professional behaviors. And he said, I am completely and utterly blown away. And if I wouldn't have embraced the concept that I have to have self awareness, I would have never been as willing on this journey as I've been. And I was like, this is exactly why the art of leadership is literally the art of waking up to how you've become you, which is how we've begun this conversation. So when you get that level of self awareness and you realize that your memories, if they're loaded with unresolved negative emotions, they're going to constantly because your subconscious mind's highest prime directive is to rise those emotional states up to the surface of your awareness so you can finally resolve them. But what people do is they push them down again. They go, oh, no, I can't deal with that. Push it down again. Then they start having experiences out in their adult life where they start feeling the same way they did as a kid, and they're like, oh, it's them. They did this bad thing to me, and they did that, and I hate them. And I'm going to drink now because that really bothered me. We develop all these bad habits trying to minimize the emotions we don't know how to handle. And what you and I are really attempting to do is say, here is a complete toolbox of information, of processes that literally work on the neurology, on the biology of emotions, and you can do them and you can get free. This is not smoke and mirrors. It's not snake oil. It works. And what I know is that when we do that, then we take the fragility we have felt from the trauma we've experienced and we turned it into an antifragile powerful force of strength, commitment, dedication and purpose. And when we do that, we find finally our center and we finally find our purpose and our power.

Jason Croft [00:39:32]:

That's so powerful. And I love this on the whole scale of it too, because if you implement, obviously, and go down and take it, use it like the executive you were talking about uses, it the life changing power. But this also causes a shift, even at the far end of the spectrum, of just the awareness that something like this is possible, that can get somebody through another day and another, like, oh, that aspect of like, oh, there's hope here. There actually is a solution. I don't even know what this is that I'm going through, but maybe there's an answer and they can go down that path and find it.

Gary De Rodriguez [00:40:15]:

Yeah, it's so important. I mean, I just got done doing the Ultimate Mindset and Coach Intensive, which I'm going to start again at the end of July. But it's a group coaching, personal development training that I'm sharing a lot of these tools and we're doing group processes as a group, and people had huge breakthroughs. And if you're in a space where you feel like, I just really need some support right now, I need some tools to learn how to work with myself, that is a low ticket item that gives you 30 hours of training, like 30 hours of coaching. You would normally have to pay like $12,000 to enroll me one on one for 30 hours. And this is I think it's like $1,400. It's like just a drop in the bucket compared to what I would normally charge. It's the best way to start this kind of process. People can click onto the website, which is www.peoplelistic.com, and all the trainings are up. You'd have to look under certification tabs, and then there's another tab for coaching, and you'll see the Ultimate Mindset under Coaching, and you'll see the trauma solution certification of the certifications, and you'll also see the Virtual Coach certification, which is a huge body of information where I train people how to coach. Like I've coached over the last 30 years, so I want to duplicate this work out there. I've got coaches out there making six figures right now because they get results. And the best advertisement you could ever have is that you get results and you change people's lives in your sessions, and then you just get a ton of word of mouth referrals. So all that's available to people, this whole aspect of how society is becoming quite a bit darker and how the light has to rise exponentially along with it. So this is my little piece of brightening up the light so more people can understand they have massive choice. And if it's part of other people's purposes to contribute that and to help other people with these kind of tools, then come on board. We're looking for you because I'm looking for the Light workers right now that are willing to say, yeah, I want to be as effective as I can possibly be with folks, and I want to come to the party and learn, and then we have a pretty powerful force for good.

Jason Croft [00:42:57]:

Absolutely love it. It's a good place to wrap up. I encourage people to check all of that out. And some of the things I love so much with all of this is that ripple effect, because we need that positive ripple effect out there, for sure.

Gary De Rodriguez [00:43:14]:

Well, you and I are like brothers from another mother. We have very, very similar values. So it's always such a pleasure to be with you and to have these levels of conversation. So. Thank you, Jake.

Jason Croft [00:43:26]:

Thank you, Gary. And we'll see you all next time.

Gary De Rodriguez [00:43:29]:

Bye bye.

Jason Croft [00:43:33]:

Thanks for joining us on another episode of Concentric. If you enjoyed this episode, we'd certainly like a great review from you on your favorite podcasting platform. But more than that, what really makes a difference to a show like ours is a recommendation to someone who would love this show like you do. Word of mouth referrals to your network, and your podcast, Devouring Friends is incredibly helpful to the growth of this show. For episode links and info, go to concentricshow.com. Thank you so much, and remember to keep building alignment to build a better life. You we.